Wayne Cohen is a veteran multi-platinum selling ASCAP hit songwriter, producer, educator, and owner of publishing/production company Stand Up Songs. He also teaches individual and group songwriting tutoring sessions at his NYC Stand Up Studio and via Skype.
Part I: To Co-Write or Not to Co-Write, that is the question...
...Whether it is nobler to toil by one’s self, or share your gift with another writer, thereby potentially exponentially expanding your songwriting and song networking reach. Well, the good news is that you can do both, which I like to do for several reasons.
I like to write by myself so that I feel I can really explore every aspect of an idea, so I won’t get lazy, and obviously, because it can be twice as lucrative if you write a hit alone.
But maybe you come up with a million melodies and no lyrics, or you have lyric ideas but no melodies, or maybe you’ve got a million melody and lyric ideas and can’t organize them enough to pull together a coherent song easily, or you’re a visionary producer/track writer/multi-instrumentalist but you need help with lyrics and or melodies; maybe you’re all of these and you just want a break from yourself. Have no fear, co-writing can be good for you. At worst, it might be a good way to get out of your own face for a while.
So I co-write, because it can be invigorating and create surprising results, and there are some obvious advantages: it expands your network for pitching, and expands your mind about the kinds of songs you can write. For me the beautiful thing about co-writing is that I don’t have to be all the people in the band I’m not (the female singer, the drummer, the amazing guitarist, etc.), and still can come up with something to be proud of – something I could never have predicted, or that either of us might have written, without a collaborator.
These days co-writing can come in several forms:
I’ve always found it wise to collaborate with people who complement what my strengths. As much fun as it could be to be in the room writing with someone who does what I do, I find it’s more productive if you work with someone who does NOT do what you do (although I have written great songs with people who share my same strenghts and weaknesses, so go figure). The greatest thing about co-writing for me is that you generally can never predict what will come out of the experience.
An effective co-write requires mutual trust and respect between collaborators. To foster 'singing the same song’ with my collaborators, after years of co-writing, I’ve found it useful to develop some simple ground rules which I call the COLLABORATOR’S CODE. Much of this is unspoken, but I find things go much better, and faster, if I have this in the back of my mind while working with a partner. Here in part one I’ll give you a preview of the code, and in part two I will delve into more code detail, and examine options for how to demo a co-written song.
But before we get to the code, I wanted to mention that when I collaborate I always like to think of it like I’m going to a party (which my mother taught me I should never do empty handed). So, rule number one is to always show up with an idea. This could be a subject, a title, a lyric, a melodic fragment (a hook is always good), basically anything that you feel passionate about that could be the basis of a breakthrough song. Having said that, I’ve shown up to plenty of co-writing sessions with an idea only to end up writing something completely unrelated. But it’s all good, ‘cuz if I don’t use an idea I just file it away, and the good ones always have a way of coming back to haunt me until they write themselves. If they don’t come back to me they probably weren’t worth much in the first place. But I find it’s better if you always bring SOMETHING to a co-write, even if you discard it.
This brings me to one of the trickiest, challenging, yet potentially rewarding aspects of co-writing, which is selling an idea to your co-writer. He or she, in effect, is the first audience for your song idea. It’s tricky because you want your co-writer to respect your ideas but to contribute as well. So my suggestion is to start by having some respect for your self and your collaborator by bringing an idea to a co-writing session that YOU like, so you can get behind selling it to your co-writer.
If you’re, deathly afraid of sharing what you think are ‘stupid’, ‘irrelevant’, ‘inconsequential’ or the ‘only great ideas I’ll ever have’, or if you think you’re ‘too good’ to co-write, check your ego at the door and GET ON WITH IT. Because, here’s the deal, no matter whether you write a #1 single or another song that sits on a shelf, you will LEARN something from the experience. Keep in mind, your co-writer is probably just as insecure or as much of an egomaniac as you are, so don’t be shy, you will still be who you are after you leave the room. And if worst comes to worst if you’re not happy with the results of the co-write you are within your rights to say, politely, to your co-writer (preferably followed by acknowledgement from them) that you’re going to take your idea back so you can write it by yourself or with someone else. So, even if all you learn is that you don’t want to co-write with that particular person again, you will gain an invaluable perspective on your place in the songwriting firmament, simply because you are sharing YOUR ideas with someone else who is listening and responding. But it’s also possible you will get something more from the experience, a great song.
But watch out, co-writing can inspire friendly (and sometimes not so friendly) competition. Some of my best work has come from passionate yelling and screaming interactions with co-writers fighting over a particular lyric or melody phrase. The right kind of creative tension can produce good work, but it has to have mutual respect at its' core, otherwise it ends up being a grandstanding session that DOES NOT work.
I’m willing to try any collaboration once, if I or someone I respect (like a publisher, manager, producer, A&R person, music supervisor or artist) has a positive instinct about it. If you decide you want to co-write, I find it’s usually good to go with your gut about whether you think you’ll click with the other writer, however you should allow a small percentage of your co-writers to be with talents that you never thought would be compatible with yours, just to keep you on your toes. Some of the greatest records have resulted from unconventional hybrids, so for example, if you’re an acoustic singer/songwriter why not see if you can vibe with an urban track writer? You may end up with a hit record that neither of you could have written by yourself.
When I was signed to Sony Music I was put together with lots of co-writers and artists. Most of these bore good-not-great songs, but I still believe ‘nothing ventured nothing gained’. You just need to be sensible about your choices, before you make them.
Even if you do all the ‘right stuff’ to prepare for a co-write, don’t be too hard on yourself. There will be days when it just doesn’t happen, even if ‘on paper’ a co-write looks like it should work just fine. I find that I usually know within the first 30 minutes whether it’s going to work. A word to the wise: if it ain’t happening I think it’s better to politely say something like “It’s great to see you today, but I have to say I think we’ve both written better songs, so I’d like to call this complete, and move on to something else.” Be smart and size up the situation in advance. If you’re both track writers and neither of you write lyrics, it’s pretty clear that you either need to not collaborate, or to include a lyricist!
So, in summary, some advantages of co-writing:
Coming up with something you would never have thought of on your own and potentially expanding your creative and song networking scope. If, for example, if you’re a country songwriter, you might be able to expand your song networking scope by writing with an urban music track writer.
And here at long last, in usual order of my experience is the…
COLLABORATOR’S CODE:
1) Come with an idea (Preview and imagine the result)
2) Get (not too) comfortable, celebrate your differences
3) Discuss objectives (Why does this song need to exist?)
4) Collaborate on creation
a) Present ideas (let them go first!)
b) Decide who’s doing what? (melody, lyrics, track)
5) Dig down, stir it up, prove your passion
6) Keep the ball rolling (“ideas are usually a whisper, not a scream…”)
7) Strive for a tangible result (I like to know that I at least have a complete melody when I walk out of the room, with a title, so it does not have to be a complete song, just something that you can build on in the next session.)
8) Steps for next time
And when the song is done:
9) Define collaborators’ contributions (songwriter splits)
10) Decide how to demo it
New Developments in co-writing:
Lately the internet programs like Skype have made it possible to get the benefit of instant feedback and the spark of collaboration without having to spend time and money to travel. For example, I’ve been working with Riccardo Foresi, an artist from Italy. The first time we worked together he was in NY but lately he’s been back in Italy and we’ve been writing utilizing the video capability of Skype as if we’re in the same room. I find that it’s still better if you start the relationship (or the song) in the same room, but with our most recent song, the collaboration took place entirely online. Riccardo sent me some melodies and a track that he had started in Italy, for which I wrote a hook, title and lyric for the melodies in NYC, and then we tweaked it together over Skype. Truly an amazing experience.
By the way, you can hear some of these Skype session results by clicking here. And we chose tunecore to get Riccardo’s music out.
Next week:
The COLLABORATOR’S CODE in greater detail, including how to define collaborator’s songwriting contributions, and options for how to demo the co-written song.
Thoughts, questions or comments? Share them here!
You can contact Wayne here or by writing to wayne@standupsongs.com
I like to write by myself so that I feel I can really explore every aspect of an idea, so I won’t get lazy, and obviously, because it can be twice as lucrative if you write a hit alone.
But maybe you come up with a million melodies and no lyrics, or you have lyric ideas but no melodies, or maybe you’ve got a million melody and lyric ideas and can’t organize them enough to pull together a coherent song easily, or you’re a visionary producer/track writer/multi-instrumentalist but you need help with lyrics and or melodies; maybe you’re all of these and you just want a break from yourself. Have no fear, co-writing can be good for you. At worst, it might be a good way to get out of your own face for a while.
So I co-write, because it can be invigorating and create surprising results, and there are some obvious advantages: it expands your network for pitching, and expands your mind about the kinds of songs you can write. For me the beautiful thing about co-writing is that I don’t have to be all the people in the band I’m not (the female singer, the drummer, the amazing guitarist, etc.), and still can come up with something to be proud of – something I could never have predicted, or that either of us might have written, without a collaborator.
These days co-writing can come in several forms:
- Melodist meets lyricist
- Melodist meets lyricist meets track writer
- Melodist/lyricist meets track writer
I’ve always found it wise to collaborate with people who complement what my strengths. As much fun as it could be to be in the room writing with someone who does what I do, I find it’s more productive if you work with someone who does NOT do what you do (although I have written great songs with people who share my same strenghts and weaknesses, so go figure). The greatest thing about co-writing for me is that you generally can never predict what will come out of the experience.
An effective co-write requires mutual trust and respect between collaborators. To foster 'singing the same song’ with my collaborators, after years of co-writing, I’ve found it useful to develop some simple ground rules which I call the COLLABORATOR’S CODE. Much of this is unspoken, but I find things go much better, and faster, if I have this in the back of my mind while working with a partner. Here in part one I’ll give you a preview of the code, and in part two I will delve into more code detail, and examine options for how to demo a co-written song.
But before we get to the code, I wanted to mention that when I collaborate I always like to think of it like I’m going to a party (which my mother taught me I should never do empty handed). So, rule number one is to always show up with an idea. This could be a subject, a title, a lyric, a melodic fragment (a hook is always good), basically anything that you feel passionate about that could be the basis of a breakthrough song. Having said that, I’ve shown up to plenty of co-writing sessions with an idea only to end up writing something completely unrelated. But it’s all good, ‘cuz if I don’t use an idea I just file it away, and the good ones always have a way of coming back to haunt me until they write themselves. If they don’t come back to me they probably weren’t worth much in the first place. But I find it’s better if you always bring SOMETHING to a co-write, even if you discard it.
This brings me to one of the trickiest, challenging, yet potentially rewarding aspects of co-writing, which is selling an idea to your co-writer. He or she, in effect, is the first audience for your song idea. It’s tricky because you want your co-writer to respect your ideas but to contribute as well. So my suggestion is to start by having some respect for your self and your collaborator by bringing an idea to a co-writing session that YOU like, so you can get behind selling it to your co-writer.
If you’re, deathly afraid of sharing what you think are ‘stupid’, ‘irrelevant’, ‘inconsequential’ or the ‘only great ideas I’ll ever have’, or if you think you’re ‘too good’ to co-write, check your ego at the door and GET ON WITH IT. Because, here’s the deal, no matter whether you write a #1 single or another song that sits on a shelf, you will LEARN something from the experience. Keep in mind, your co-writer is probably just as insecure or as much of an egomaniac as you are, so don’t be shy, you will still be who you are after you leave the room. And if worst comes to worst if you’re not happy with the results of the co-write you are within your rights to say, politely, to your co-writer (preferably followed by acknowledgement from them) that you’re going to take your idea back so you can write it by yourself or with someone else. So, even if all you learn is that you don’t want to co-write with that particular person again, you will gain an invaluable perspective on your place in the songwriting firmament, simply because you are sharing YOUR ideas with someone else who is listening and responding. But it’s also possible you will get something more from the experience, a great song.
But watch out, co-writing can inspire friendly (and sometimes not so friendly) competition. Some of my best work has come from passionate yelling and screaming interactions with co-writers fighting over a particular lyric or melody phrase. The right kind of creative tension can produce good work, but it has to have mutual respect at its' core, otherwise it ends up being a grandstanding session that DOES NOT work.
I’m willing to try any collaboration once, if I or someone I respect (like a publisher, manager, producer, A&R person, music supervisor or artist) has a positive instinct about it. If you decide you want to co-write, I find it’s usually good to go with your gut about whether you think you’ll click with the other writer, however you should allow a small percentage of your co-writers to be with talents that you never thought would be compatible with yours, just to keep you on your toes. Some of the greatest records have resulted from unconventional hybrids, so for example, if you’re an acoustic singer/songwriter why not see if you can vibe with an urban track writer? You may end up with a hit record that neither of you could have written by yourself.
When I was signed to Sony Music I was put together with lots of co-writers and artists. Most of these bore good-not-great songs, but I still believe ‘nothing ventured nothing gained’. You just need to be sensible about your choices, before you make them.
Even if you do all the ‘right stuff’ to prepare for a co-write, don’t be too hard on yourself. There will be days when it just doesn’t happen, even if ‘on paper’ a co-write looks like it should work just fine. I find that I usually know within the first 30 minutes whether it’s going to work. A word to the wise: if it ain’t happening I think it’s better to politely say something like “It’s great to see you today, but I have to say I think we’ve both written better songs, so I’d like to call this complete, and move on to something else.” Be smart and size up the situation in advance. If you’re both track writers and neither of you write lyrics, it’s pretty clear that you either need to not collaborate, or to include a lyricist!
So, in summary, some advantages of co-writing:
Coming up with something you would never have thought of on your own and potentially expanding your creative and song networking scope. If, for example, if you’re a country songwriter, you might be able to expand your song networking scope by writing with an urban music track writer.
And here at long last, in usual order of my experience is the…
COLLABORATOR’S CODE:
1) Come with an idea (Preview and imagine the result)
2) Get (not too) comfortable, celebrate your differences
3) Discuss objectives (Why does this song need to exist?)
4) Collaborate on creation
a) Present ideas (let them go first!)
b) Decide who’s doing what? (melody, lyrics, track)
5) Dig down, stir it up, prove your passion
6) Keep the ball rolling (“ideas are usually a whisper, not a scream…”)
7) Strive for a tangible result (I like to know that I at least have a complete melody when I walk out of the room, with a title, so it does not have to be a complete song, just something that you can build on in the next session.)
8) Steps for next time
And when the song is done:
9) Define collaborators’ contributions (songwriter splits)
10) Decide how to demo it
New Developments in co-writing:
Lately the internet programs like Skype have made it possible to get the benefit of instant feedback and the spark of collaboration without having to spend time and money to travel. For example, I’ve been working with Riccardo Foresi, an artist from Italy. The first time we worked together he was in NY but lately he’s been back in Italy and we’ve been writing utilizing the video capability of Skype as if we’re in the same room. I find that it’s still better if you start the relationship (or the song) in the same room, but with our most recent song, the collaboration took place entirely online. Riccardo sent me some melodies and a track that he had started in Italy, for which I wrote a hook, title and lyric for the melodies in NYC, and then we tweaked it together over Skype. Truly an amazing experience.
By the way, you can hear some of these Skype session results by clicking here. And we chose tunecore to get Riccardo’s music out.
Next week:
The COLLABORATOR’S CODE in greater detail, including how to define collaborator’s songwriting contributions, and options for how to demo the co-written song.
Thoughts, questions or comments? Share them here!
You can contact Wayne here or by writing to wayne@standupsongs.com
Wayne,
Thank you for taking the time to write this. It's an awesome post.
Co-writing has led to some of my best tracks (one of which is now on my blog, URL below) and for me co-writing is as much about lyrics and melody as it is about parts (riffs and the like). A great part can make a song, and deserves to be recognized for the value it brings. What do others think about this?
Jeff
www.cerebellumblues.com
Posted by: Jeff Shattuck | July 24, 2009 at 11:56 AM
I'd like to add some thought to CODE:
"Song is more important than your ego when you collaborate with somebody"
All co-workers should agree with this statement before start.
And if somebody heard my tunes and liked them... we could collab!
Posted by: Alek | July 24, 2009 at 04:00 AM
Hey, thanks for another great article Wayne! I'm trying to figure out what kind of percentage splits are usually appropriate. I write the music (chord progressions and melodies) and I cowrite the lyrics with someone else. So, she cowrites the lyrics, but not the music. Now in addition, we are letting my drummer have a crack at the arrangements and track production in the studio. I'm not sure what the percentages should be. Can you (or anyone) give any guidance?
By the way, we sent you a FedEx package with our CD a couple months ago... did you get it?
Also, if any hiphop or electronic music writer/producer would like to collaborate after looking at myspace.com/alexarndt, please contact me. ~Alex
Posted by: Alex Arndt | July 24, 2009 at 12:10 AM
Fear is good. I've been writing for over 30 years in Nashville. Sometimes walking into a room with someone you 've never met without a an idea in your head is pure medicine.
then again...
if you don't try it, you'll never know.
Posted by: Jon Pousette-Dart | July 23, 2009 at 08:39 PM
It is always a good idea to discuss how each cowriter views contributions. I think that it should be addressed at the beginning of a collaboration (as well as the end, again). One thing that comes to mind is how to handle the process when one is the demo maker and also a co-writer. I am looking forward to reading the second part of this blog.
Posted by: mez | July 23, 2009 at 07:07 PM
Great article, I always love these emails cause they always contain valuable/intelletual info. I do urban electric rock music and im collaberating with a folk song writer/lyricist so this article confirmed my decision to co-write with different styles. This will be my first time co-writing with another so the "code" really helps out. Its seems to me that its all pretty much just common sense. thankyou
Posted by: DECKQ | July 23, 2009 at 07:01 PM
I know more than a few people who would highly benefit from reading this article... then again, these are the same people who thing "collaborating" means "come into a session and teach everyone else the parts you've already written for them."
I don't like to say that some people are hopeless collaborators, but when you've worked with more than your fair share of egomaniacs, it's not that difficult to think otherwise. Thanks for the article, Wayne - at least I'll be sure to keep the Code in the back of my head next time I'm collab'ing. We can only hope the others will, as well...
Posted by: Alvin Pingol | July 23, 2009 at 06:46 PM